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After, or when it comes to: 〜上で

Verb-た + 上で ; N + の上(で) ; Verb (dictionary) + 上で

Verb-た / N の + 上で: after doing X, building on it. Verb (dictionary) + 上で: for, when it comes to X. Formal register.

In short

〜上で has two meanings depending on the verb form. After a past-tense verb (考えた上で), it means “after doing X, and on that basis”: you act once the preliminary step is done. After a verb in the dictionary form (暮らす上で), it means “for, when it comes to”: what matters when you do X. Formal register: advice, procedures, instructions.

  • よく考えた上で、お返事します。よくかんがえたうえで、おへんじします。I'll give you my answer after thinking it over carefully.
  • 両親と相談した上で、留学を決めた。りょうしんとそうだんしたうえで、りゅうがくをきめた。It was after talking it over with my parents that I decided to study abroad.
  • 内容をご確認の上、サインをお願いします。ないようをごかくにんのうえ、さいんをおねがいします。Please sign after checking the contents.
  • 日本で暮らす上で、ゴミの出し方を知っておくことは大切だ。にほんでくらすうえで、ごみのだしかたをしっておくことはたいせつだ。When you live in Japan, it's important to know how to put out the rubbish.

The basics

上 (うえ) is “the top”. So 〜上で is “on the basis of”, “on the ground of”. Depending on what comes before, the expression takes two quite separate meanings.

With a past-tense verb, you build on a step already taken: “after doing X, and taking X into account”. It's not mere succession: the first action shapes the second (you think, then you decide in light of your thinking). With a present-tense verb, you're talking about a field of activity: “for X, when you do X”.

The sentence, piece by piece
両親とwith my parents
相談したhaving consulted (past)
上でafter, and on that basis
留学をstudying abroad (object)
決めたdecided

It was after talking it over with my parents that I decided to study abroad.

  • noun
  • verb
  • grammatical form
  • 実物を見た上で、買うかどうか決めます。じつぶつをみたうえで、かうかどうかきめます。I'll decide whether to buy it after seeing the real thing.
  • 仕事を進める上で、いちばん大事なのは連絡です。しごとをすすめるうえで、いちばんだいじなのはれんらくです。When it comes to moving work forward, the most important thing is communication.

How to form it

The meaning depends entirely on the form before it. Remember: past = “after”, dictionary = “for, when it comes to”. After an action noun, you add の, and in written instructions で is often dropped: ご確認の上、ご記入の上.

ConstructionMeaningExample
Verb-た + 上でafter doing (and on that basis)考えた上で決める
N + の上(で)after (written instructions)ご確認の上、ご記入ください
Verb (dictionary) + 上でfor, when it comes to暮らす上で大切なこと
Verb (dictionary) + 上での + Nrelating to doing働く上での注意
  • 必要事項をご記入の上、窓口にお出しください。ひつようじこうをごきにゅうのうえ、まどぐちにおだしください。Please fill in the required fields, then hand the form in at the counter.
  • これは、名古屋で生活する上での注意をまとめた本です。これは、なごやでせいかつするうえでのちゅういをまとめたほんです。This is a book that gathers advice for living in Nagoya.

上で, てから, ために

てから (N5) only gives the order: A, then B. 上で says that A is a precondition that B takes into account. 「ご飯を食べてから出かける」 is natural; 「ご飯を食べた上で出かける」 sounds odd, because eating isn't a considered step that the outing is based on.

In the present, ために expresses the goal you're pursuing (合格するために勉強する). 上で doesn't state a goal: it marks the field in which something is important, useful or problematic. So you find it with 大切だ, 必要だ, 役に立つ, 問題になる.

ExpressionWhat it saysExample
てからsimple time order食べてから出かける
た上でafter, and building on it見た上で決める
ためにgoal to reach合格するために勉強する
る上でin the field of, for勉強する上で大切なこと
  • シャワーを浴びてから寝た。しゃわーをあびてからねた。I had a shower, then went to bed. (simple succession)
  • この資格は、仕事をする上でとても役に立つ。このしかくは、しごとをするうえでとてもやくにたつ。This qualification is very useful for work.

Don't confuse it with 上に and 上は

Three expressions look alike but have nothing in common. 上に (N3) means “on top of, besides”: この店は安い上においしい. 上は (N2, line 5) means “since, now that” and announces a resolution: 約束した上は、守る. Finally, 上で is “after” or “when it comes to”.

  • この店は安い上に、サービスもいい。このみせはやすいうえに、さーびすもいい。This restaurant is cheap, and on top of that the service is good.
  • 条件を聞いた上で、引き受けるかどうか考えます。じょうけんをきいたうえで、ひきうけるかどうかかんがえます。I'll hear the conditions first, then think about whether to accept.

Common mistakes

  • Reading 上で as physical “on”: in this expression there's no idea of position at all.
  • Using た上で for a plain, everyday succession (食べた上で寝る): you need a step that the next decision is based on.
  • Mixing up 上で (after, when it comes to), 上に (on top of) and 上は (since): one kana changes, and so does the meaning.
  • Forgetting の after a noun: you say ご確認の上, not “ご確認上”.

8 exercises on this point

Particles to choose, sentences to put back in order, translations: marked straight away, then reviewed at the right time. This JLPT N2 point is on the Higashiyama Line (The working world) of the Nagoya lines.