After, or when it comes to: 〜上で
Verb-た + 上で ; N + の上(で) ; Verb (dictionary) + 上で
Verb-た / N の + 上で: after doing X, building on it. Verb (dictionary) + 上で: for, when it comes to X. Formal register.
In short
〜上で has two meanings depending on the verb form. After a past-tense verb (考えた上で), it means “after doing X, and on that basis”: you act once the preliminary step is done. After a verb in the dictionary form (暮らす上で), it means “for, when it comes to”: what matters when you do X. Formal register: advice, procedures, instructions.
- よく考えた上で、お返事します。よくかんがえたうえで、おへんじします。I'll give you my answer after thinking it over carefully.
- 両親と相談した上で、留学を決めた。りょうしんとそうだんしたうえで、りゅうがくをきめた。It was after talking it over with my parents that I decided to study abroad.
- 内容をご確認の上、サインをお願いします。ないようをごかくにんのうえ、さいんをおねがいします。Please sign after checking the contents.
- 日本で暮らす上で、ゴミの出し方を知っておくことは大切だ。にほんでくらすうえで、ごみのだしかたをしっておくことはたいせつだ。When you live in Japan, it's important to know how to put out the rubbish.
The basics
上 (うえ) is “the top”. So 〜上で is “on the basis of”, “on the ground of”. Depending on what comes before, the expression takes two quite separate meanings.
With a past-tense verb, you build on a step already taken: “after doing X, and taking X into account”. It's not mere succession: the first action shapes the second (you think, then you decide in light of your thinking). With a present-tense verb, you're talking about a field of activity: “for X, when you do X”.
It was after talking it over with my parents that I decided to study abroad.
- noun
- verb
- grammatical form
- 実物を見た上で、買うかどうか決めます。じつぶつをみたうえで、かうかどうかきめます。I'll decide whether to buy it after seeing the real thing.
- 仕事を進める上で、いちばん大事なのは連絡です。しごとをすすめるうえで、いちばんだいじなのはれんらくです。When it comes to moving work forward, the most important thing is communication.
How to form it
The meaning depends entirely on the form before it. Remember: past = “after”, dictionary = “for, when it comes to”. After an action noun, you add の, and in written instructions で is often dropped: ご確認の上、ご記入の上.
| Construction | Meaning | Example |
|---|---|---|
| Verb-た + 上で | after doing (and on that basis) | 考えた上で決める |
| N + の上(で) | after (written instructions) | ご確認の上、ご記入ください |
| Verb (dictionary) + 上で | for, when it comes to | 暮らす上で大切なこと |
| Verb (dictionary) + 上での + N | relating to doing | 働く上での注意 |
- 必要事項をご記入の上、窓口にお出しください。ひつようじこうをごきにゅうのうえ、まどぐちにおだしください。Please fill in the required fields, then hand the form in at the counter.
- これは、名古屋で生活する上での注意をまとめた本です。これは、なごやでせいかつするうえでのちゅういをまとめたほんです。This is a book that gathers advice for living in Nagoya.
上で, てから, ために
てから (N5) only gives the order: A, then B. 上で says that A is a precondition that B takes into account. 「ご飯を食べてから出かける」 is natural; 「ご飯を食べた上で出かける」 sounds odd, because eating isn't a considered step that the outing is based on.
In the present, ために expresses the goal you're pursuing (合格するために勉強する). 上で doesn't state a goal: it marks the field in which something is important, useful or problematic. So you find it with 大切だ, 必要だ, 役に立つ, 問題になる.
| Expression | What it says | Example |
|---|---|---|
| てから | simple time order | 食べてから出かける |
| た上で | after, and building on it | 見た上で決める |
| ために | goal to reach | 合格するために勉強する |
| る上で | in the field of, for | 勉強する上で大切なこと |
- シャワーを浴びてから寝た。しゃわーをあびてからねた。I had a shower, then went to bed. (simple succession)
- この資格は、仕事をする上でとても役に立つ。このしかくは、しごとをするうえでとてもやくにたつ。This qualification is very useful for work.
Don't confuse it with 上に and 上は
Three expressions look alike but have nothing in common. 上に (N3) means “on top of, besides”: この店は安い上においしい. 上は (N2, line 5) means “since, now that” and announces a resolution: 約束した上は、守る. Finally, 上で is “after” or “when it comes to”.
- この店は安い上に、サービスもいい。このみせはやすいうえに、さーびすもいい。This restaurant is cheap, and on top of that the service is good.
- 条件を聞いた上で、引き受けるかどうか考えます。じょうけんをきいたうえで、ひきうけるかどうかかんがえます。I'll hear the conditions first, then think about whether to accept.
Common mistakes
- Reading 上で as physical “on”: in this expression there's no idea of position at all.
- Using た上で for a plain, everyday succession (食べた上で寝る): you need a step that the next decision is based on.
- Mixing up 上で (after, when it comes to), 上に (on top of) and 上は (since): one kana changes, and so does the meaning.
- Forgetting の after a noun: you say ご確認の上, not “ご確認上”.
8 exercises on this point
Particles to choose, sentences to put back in order, translations: marked straight away, then reviewed at the right time. This JLPT N2 point is on the Higashiyama Line (The working world) of the Nagoya lines.